The Trouble with Jesus: From Doubt to Faith | Constance Hastings | 028

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I have purpose.
I have a reason to get up, I

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have a place in which to serve.
I have people who've come into

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my life that I never would have
known otherwise, and that's been

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the biggest difference.
Welcome to When You Look, where

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ordinary people share their
extraordinary experiences and

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you get to decide was it
coincidence or God?

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Constance, Welcome to When You
Look.

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So Great to have you on the
show.

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It's great to be here, Nick.
Well, we're excited to have a

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wonderful conversation, hear
about the book that you have

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written, but also your story.
So let's jump into all of that

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after we learn a little bit more
about you.

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So tell us a little bit about
yourself.

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Well, Nick, sometimes I say I
shouldn't be where I am today.

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And it's it started early in
life.

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My family was not particularly
religious.

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However, it was during the time
of desegregation.

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My parents, not wanting me to be
caught up in that, decided to

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send me to a private school.
And right down the street there

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was a small independent
Christian School that wasn't

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very expensive and they felt I
would be safe there.

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So that's where they sent me.
Oh, I was very safe there, So

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safe that God grabbed me.
And there in the love of those

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teachers, I met my Lord and
Savior.

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And that stayed with me, even
though, as I said, I was in a

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family, which was not one that
I, I mean, it was very loving

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family and and, you know,
supportive, but they just didn't

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quite understand why it was that
I was doing so well.

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Let's say in Bible study, I
excelled.

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There were kids in the class
whose parents were pastors and

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missionaries.
My dad owned a bar and I won the

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Bible be twice.
So in that regard, God just kept

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his hand on me in high school
and in college.

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I did not though, have a
supportive family or even a

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church family to hold me, but
those feet, they still were part

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of that and still kept me in
God's hand.

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When I graduated from college,
the only job I could get

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teaching at the time was in a
school where my department chair

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was also the son of a pastor.
And we began dating.

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And of course, he wanted me to
go to church with him, which I

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did and found that I knew more
about the Bible and I knew the

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hymns better than anybody else
in the church.

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However, I didn't want to join
the church.

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And this went on for 20 years.
I would be asked by pastors and

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other people, why did you join
the church?

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It's like, why?
You know, I look around here and

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I see people who just come
because it's, you know, a social

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thing to do or a place to drop
their kids and things like that.

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And they didn't have a real full
understanding in life in Jesus

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Christ.
And I wanted to put my name on

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that kind of a list that thank
you.

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But it was during Lent.
And at that time, I thought what

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I would do is give up music for
that period.

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Now I'm the kind who always has
music on, but I thought I'd just

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see in the silence if God had
anything to say.

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And God said, join your church.
And I'm like, why?

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Well, this went back and forth
for several weeks and it was

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during Holy Week almost to up to
actually Good Friday that God

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said during your church.
And then I read that when Jesus

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went before Pilate, Pilate said
to him, you're leaders, you're

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the chief priests have brought
you here.

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And I thought if Jesus would not
walk away from his church, but

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stayed there, taught in the
temple and in the synagogues and

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ministered to people from that
place, how could I refuse to

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join mine?
And so I did.

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And I thought that the Holy
Spirit would get off my back and

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I could go on and live my life
as I thought, as I thought I

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should.
At the time I was teaching at a

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Community College.
I always wore a cross to teach

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in.
I would pray with my students

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not only for their academic
success, but also in personal

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ways.
And I thought I was serving God

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pretty well.
That should be enough as I was.

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Again, the Holy Spirit came and
said, no, I want you to be going

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to more committed, formal
ministry.

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And I'm thinking you got to be
kidding.

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You have got to be kidding.
I cannot see myself working in a

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church and certainly not in the
Pasco ministry.

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But that that wouldn't go away.
And I went to my pastor and

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talked and said, you know, this
doesn't make sense.

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And they said, OK, but we got to
tell you something.

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At that time it was a Methodist
Church and there was being

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formed what was an order of
Deacon who would have a ministry

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between the church and the world
and where I was teaching.

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There also was a master's degree
program in counseling.

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And the day I realized it, I was
absolutely trembling and I knew

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that my call would be to become
trained as a mental health

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counselor, to enter a
faith-based practice and serve

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my church in that way.
And that's exactly what

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happened.
Again, not my plan, not where I

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thought it was headed, not what
I even wanted, but where God was

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leading me.
I had that practice for 18 years

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and I was working alongside a
church and my husband was there

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and we were teaching and leading
small groups and all those kinds

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of things that again, God should
be happy with this.

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But as it was, I had been given
and not because I wanted to, but

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then given a book to write.
But ministry kept me so busy.

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I never had the time to actually
sit down and focus my husband.

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My son came to me and said, we
want you to retire and move

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closer to where our son lived.
And I said, OK, I'll do that.

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But you've got to give me time
and space to write this book,

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which they did.
And that became the trouble with

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Jesus considerations before you
walk away.

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That process of writing a book,
that process of speaking about

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it and speaking into places
again where I never would go

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otherwise is how God has led me.
Now you could say that a lot of

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this was based upon my own
choice, and I do believe God

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gives us choice.
But those choices were such that

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they were made unmistakably in
faith, most of the time not

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knowing where I was going but
where God was waiting.

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That, in short, is how I came to
be here.

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Yeah.
Wow.

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Constance, thank you for giving
us all of that back story.

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I want to explore a bunch of
this a little bit more, and then

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we'll go into a bit more about
the book because I think we've

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got some great discussion there
as well.

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But you talked about, as the
master's program became evident

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to you, this sort of clarity,
but also this trembling.

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Tell us a little bit more about
that.

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I knew that taking this step
would turn my life upside down.

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I had thought that my place in
life was to be a teacher.

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And again, it was often to the
disadvantage.

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And I just that's that's just
where I was so much in a place

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of comfort.
What happened was when I went

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into counseling, I lost that
comfort.

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As a teacher, I excelled, but as
a counselor, I had such a deep,

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steep learning curve and so
dependent upon God as I would

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meet my clients and in the the
troubles and the trauma that

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they had.
And it wasn't a comfortable

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place for me for a very, very
long time.

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I had a lot of insecurities and
again, knowing that entering

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into this kind of life in
ministry that my, my income

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would be impacted and I lost
probably about $40,000 in salary

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in six weeks, you know, by by
entering into that.

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And yet I'm, I just have to say
that God's provision has been

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there all the way through.
I lack for nothing.

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And not just my needs, but you
know, some of my desires of

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comfort in life have have all
been met.

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Now, do I, you know, do I live
in luxury and lavishness and all

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that?
No.

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But I'm, you know, I tell people
when I talk about this, do I

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look like I'm hurting?
I'm not God's provision.

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God's grace is all upon me.
Yeah, wow.

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Praise God.
Thanks for kind of breaking that

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down for us.
But you talked about the

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insecurities, the steep learning
curve.

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You were in counseling for 18
years.

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How did you navigate all of
that?

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As I said, it was very much
depended upon where where God

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was leading me and I connected
with a faith-based counseling

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agency that would allow
counselors to work out of

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churches.
We didn't have a central office,

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so to speak.
I so I had that, that support

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that supervision within that
group.

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But I there was a place of
independence and basically I had

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to work as a spiritual
entrepreneur in that way.

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And the the fears would would
come again in the insecurities

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of not feeling totally confident
or competent.

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Then again, when you sit, you
know, across the table, you

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know, in chairs with people who
are very, very much in pain, you

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really are looking into that,
the depth of that.

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And you realize that sometimes
that you don't have anything to

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give them.
But your presence and not having

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all of the answers was, was
something that I had to accept.

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And again, given, sometimes I
would tell people, I know where

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you are.
I give you my faith and that was

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the best that I could give them
in the grace of God.

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Other times I would tell people
if I could fix your problems, I

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would be a very rich woman.
So fixing problems wasn't my

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call, but rather, again, to walk
in those journeys with them and

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to listen to them.
And yeah, I I would of course

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make suggestions as to what they
could do, but to support,

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encourage, and to give them that
confidence in nothing else that

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God's love would never, ever
leave them.

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Yeah, I'm right on.
That's very, very cool.

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Well, one of the things you
mentioned a few moments ago was

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that you were given a book to
write.

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Tell us not yet about the book,
but how, how or what?

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What gets you to the point of
your saying I was given this?

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Tell us more about that.
I was working in a church, but

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down the street was another
church and the women of that

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church asked me to do a Saturday
morning Bible study, a mini

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retreat kind of thing, which I
agreed to do.

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Fortunately, they gave me
several months to think and plan

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for it.
I knew these women, they were

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smart, professional leaders, and
I wanted something that would

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have a good impact on them from
the Spirit of God.

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So I started searching for what
that would be.

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Now, Nick, you may know there
are 66 books in the Bible and I

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could not find one message.
I'm getting frustrated.

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And it's like, what is going on
here?

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What do you want me to do?
And one day I just looked up and

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I said, the troubles with Jesus.
Oh, and I sat down, I started an

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outline.
I started fleshing it out.

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I was able to structure it for
that particular morning and it

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was well received.
Went back to my home church, did

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it again, well received.
And then before I knew it, I was

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like, oh, this is a book.
This is a what you want me to

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do.
This is going to be a book

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someday.
So that's what I mean when I say

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I was given the book.
I again, I had no intention to

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write a book to do anything like
that.

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Now, granted, I have a degree in
English.

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I taught English for 25 years.
I've read a lot of great

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literature.
I know all of that, but never

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had that desire to actually do
it until God said you're going

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to do it.
And this is my story.

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Yeah, my story, man, Praise God.
Well, tell us a little bit about

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the book and then we'll get into
some conversation about some of

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those elements.
So give us an overview of it.

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I'm always asked this question,
so I'll just put this out there

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right now.
People often want to know the

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trouble with Jesus.
Do you have a problem with God?

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I say I don't have a problem
with God, at least no more than

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most people do.
But in that it is a book that is

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written first for the doubter or
the skeptic.

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It has a voice in it that
continually challenges the

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narration of Jesus story.
And it's sarcastic and it's

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questioning.
And there is at times an

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interplay between this voice and
the narration.

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It, it, it is the voice that is
a commentary on what the is

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playing out in the action.
And that's how it was, it was

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meant and how it was meant to
be.

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Now, in the narration, the
trouble with Jesus is Jesus was

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born into trouble.
Yeah.

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You, you, you take away all the
fairy dust out of the Christmas

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story and you've got, I hear
this couple, they're technically

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not married.
She's pregnant.

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The government steps in and says
late in her pregnancy, you need

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to go to this place where your
husband's family's from that was

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about 70 miles away.
They arrived, no place to stay.

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She has this baby in a barn.
And, you know, while she's

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there, that very night, they get
stormed with these shepherds

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that come in out of the fields
and they're all excited.

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And then the next thing you
know, it was some time later,

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but her husband gets a word from
God that they need to get out of

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there because Herod is going to
come.

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And that story, that Christmas
story actually ends with the

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slaughter of the baby boys in
Bethlehem.

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And that's what happens when
Jesus comes.

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There's going to be trouble.
Things are going to happen not

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as we want but as they do in
life and the world throws the

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worst of itself at us.
In Jesus ministry he met with a

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lot of trouble.
He was always tangling with the

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the Pharisees and healing on the
Sabbath and you know those kinds

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of things.
And other people were pushing

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for him to do what they wanted
him to do.

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We remember in the story with
Mary and Martha, after they had

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lost their brother Lazarus,
Jesus delays coming.

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And when he does, Lazarus has
already passed away.

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Martha meets him.
And the first thing that Martha

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says to him is, Lord, if you had
been here, my brother would not

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have died.
And you can hear in that there's

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a manipulation and there's
challenge and there's, you know,

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blaming him.
And this is what Jesus was met

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with time and time again.
We know that in the end of that

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story, when Jesus goes to the
tomb in which Lazarus is buried,

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there's the shortest verse of
the Bible.

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Jesus wept.
But if you go back and you look

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into the Greek translation
there, it means that Jesus was

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very angry and he had this kind
of anger mixed with grief.

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And we do know that grief does
entail anger to some point.

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But part of his anger was he was
being pushed to be who people

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wanted him to be and not the
Messiah who would come not to

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change the situation of their
lives and be that Messiah who

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would drive out the Romans and
raise them back to the Kingdom

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that David had, but rather than
the Messiah who would come and

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change hearts.
So Jesus had all kinds of

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trouble like that which all
converged at his crucifixion.

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But in his resurrection he
overcame the worst that the

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world could throw at him.
He overcame that trouble and He

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lives so that we can live in the
grace that He affords us and be

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able to overcome not only the
troubles that we have in our

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lives, but to meet the world in
its trouble as well.

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Yeah, thanks.
Wow, what a what a neat overview

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and looking at things a little
bit differently when, as you

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said, you remove the fairy dust
from certain stories.

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So really, really appreciate
that.

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Why did you decide to write it
from the point of view, or at

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least bringing the voice in of a
skeptic?

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00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:52,000
As I said, I taught for 25 years
and this was in public education

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as well as an 18 year practice
in the in counseling.

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And I've heard those voices,
those, those are voices that are

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very prevalent and challenging.
And so when I started to use

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that voice, you know, God
brought this back to me,

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however.
When I went to have the

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manuscript edited, I
deliberately looked for an

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editor who would act as that
skeptic, that doubter, and would

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00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:27,480
read from that perspective.
And I asked her, I said, when

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you read this, I want you to
read this and tell me if this

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voice sounds true to you.
And having completed the

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manuscript, she said, yes, it
does, except in the latter

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chapters.
There are some parts in the

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narration which I think sounds
like that doubter.

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And I went, Oh my goodness,
those are my doubts now.

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Those are my questions.
And I had to go back.

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00:20:54,640 --> 00:21:01,280
And we buy some of that.
But the truth is we all have

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within us those questions, those
doubts.

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And and that does lead, you
know, in a life that is truly

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honest and following Jesus
Christ, that there there is that

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00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:17,640
tension in our faith that we
have to recognize and wrestle

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00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:21,520
with often.
Yeah, I track with you on that

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00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:25,760
for sure.
Give us a sense for what are

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00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:29,760
some of those lingering
questions that long time

305
00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:33,760
believers have that create some
degree, perhaps of doubt for

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00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:37,440
them?
Suffering is a big part of that.

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00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:40,960
You know, you look at physical
suffering, there is not a

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00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:47,360
family, not a single family that
doesn't have an experience with

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cancer in some form.
I mean, that is just so

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prevalent.
We all know that when that

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00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:57,400
diagnosis comes, that life is
going to be changed in so many

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00:21:57,400 --> 00:21:59,480
ways.
Thank God, you know, there have

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00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:02,960
been advances to help with the
healing of that.

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00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:07,600
But him, why, why, why doesn't
this go away?

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00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:11,720
Why, why are so many people
affected and and afflicted by

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00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:15,160
it?
In my own family, my

317
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:21,520
father-in-law was, as I said, a
pastor and he was stricken with

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00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:26,480
Parkinson's disease, which
actually it was when he was in

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00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:29,440
his 40s and he had to leave the
ministry.

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00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:33,000
And here was a man who was very
dedicated to God and his

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00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:39,800
ministry was talented, people
loved him, but he had to, he

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00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:44,320
actually, the story goes, the
tremors took over one day when

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00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:48,000
he was in the pulpit and it had
to be carried from the pulpit

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back to the Parsonage across the
street.

325
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And he never went back again. 38
years.

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He lived with that and suffering
and my mother-in-law took took

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00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:00,640
care of him.
But you know, many people would

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00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:05,200
say to us, why did God do this?
Why did you have to suffer like

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00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:08,400
this?
So suffering is part of it.

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00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:13,520
Then there is, of course, the
culture, the society who would

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drag up all kinds of questions
and criticisms of Christians

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00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:24,320
and, and bring those out.
And yeah, that, that's hard to

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00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:29,520
see sometimes as well.
I sometimes even to the point of

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00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:36,600
having to separate what people
have seen in the church to who

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00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:41,400
God is in Jesus Christ.
And, and that's, that's a big

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00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:45,360
leap for a lot of people.
I, I can't say I blame them.

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00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:48,600
I can't say it's not real, but
it's there.

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So those kinds of things from,
from our culture.

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The other part, of course, are
the voices.

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You don't have to go to church.
You don't have to be part of

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00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:03,040
this.
You know, you don't have to give

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00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:06,080
your money.
You can live your life you want

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00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:10,000
and as long as you're a good
person, God will be OK with it.

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So the lies that people here as
well and all of this we are in a

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00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:25,040
battle in in a real way to check
that the narrative that's out

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00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:27,760
there.
And one person the one time gave

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00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:31,880
me real encouragement in the
book and he said, if you can

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00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:38,480
move the needle just to where it
points just to Jesus, that is

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where God can move and take
over.

350
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And that's pretty much been my
prayer for this book.

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Yeah, well that certainly would
be life changing for so many

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people.
Constance define for us the

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00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:58,760
difference between doubt and not
believing.

354
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:09,600
As I said, we all have doubts.
I'm I'm giving my doubt when I

355
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:13,400
pray.
I believe God can.

356
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:19,440
And like most people, I have a
lot to pray for in my family,

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00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:23,880
within my my church, the
fellowship there, you know, for,

358
00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,280
for our nation and the world
there, there's a lot to pray

359
00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:32,240
for.
My doubt comes when it's not

360
00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:38,000
that I don't believe that God
can, but will God.

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Now, when I pray for the family
member, you know, I say God.

362
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And this is for salvation.
Yeah.

363
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:48,920
Think about what you did for
Paul.

364
00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:54,120
You, you struck him blind and
spoke to him audibly.

365
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,480
You know, why can't you do half
of that for at least this

366
00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:03,360
person?
And you know, it's maybe it, it

367
00:26:03,360 --> 00:26:08,480
sounds ridiculous, but that's
what I know it's going to take,

368
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it's going to take an experience
of God.

369
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And there have been many
opportunities and experiences of

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00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:20,960
God this person could have had
like continually closes their

371
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,360
eyes to it.
And I just have to stay there on

372
00:26:24,360 --> 00:26:29,720
my knees praying for that.
And that's that's where I think

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00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,480
Christians sometimes have have
their doubts.

374
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What does give me encouragement
is if you believe in the

375
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:45,680
physical resurrection of Jesus
Christ, then you can believe

376
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:50,280
everything that God said he did
and every promise and what God

377
00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:53,720
says he will do.
And, and that's where I stay.

378
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,800
I don't know how, I don't know
when, I don't know if I'll live

379
00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:02,400
long enough to see it.
But that's where I stay in that

380
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:06,760
hope and promise that Jesus
Christ brought to us from the

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00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:09,920
cross through the grave to the
empty tomb.

382
00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:14,640
Wow, man, that's really
enlightening.

383
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:19,400
You essentially just described
if I can, if I can believe this

384
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:25,800
one time, then I can as a result
believe the rest of the times,

385
00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:29,960
believe all of the other things.
And I think it's a really cogent

386
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:33,800
way to process all of that.
So thank you.

387
00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:39,520
Thank you for that.
In your experience, teaching,

388
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:44,360
counseling, etcetera, what is it
that you have heard from

389
00:27:44,360 --> 00:27:48,320
skeptics that aren't yet
Christians?

390
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:54,680
That they have doubt, wonder,
disbelief, whatever it might be

391
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:58,000
about Christianity?
What are they looking for?

392
00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:07,400
A lot of people are interested
in other beliefs or faith

393
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:15,960
traditions where they they are
the ones in control and doing

394
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:18,560
what they think should take them
to God.

395
00:28:19,120 --> 00:28:23,080
A man one time said, I believe
it was in India, there was a

396
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:27,640
very, very poor village, but the
people were very faithful in

397
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:33,120
going to the local temple and
giving a large portion of their

398
00:28:33,120 --> 00:28:37,160
income, believing that that
would then when they passed,

399
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:40,600
take them into karma or heaven
or something like that.

400
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,920
And I spoke to him and I said
that that's the distinction with

401
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:51,400
Christianity.
It's not that we go to God, but

402
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,640
God in Jesus Christ has come to
us.

403
00:28:55,360 --> 00:29:05,160
And what that does then is it
takes away this system of my my

404
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:09,280
control.
When I talk to skeptics or

405
00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:12,560
doubters, I often hear in them,
and this is part of my

406
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:20,720
counseling voice of their past
experiences at which show me

407
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:25,720
that they want control over what
has happened to them now.

408
00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,480
Control is huge for all of us.
We like to have a measure of

409
00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:31,960
control.
You think about when a baby is

410
00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:36,280
born, a baby can do nothing but
cry, but that is his or her

411
00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:40,240
system of getting control and
getting his or her needs met.

412
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:46,280
As we grow, we learn how to
negotiate for for our needs and

413
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:50,040
the things that we want in life.
We, we know that certain choices

414
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:54,240
will bring us certain rewards
and all of that is based on this

415
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,880
need for control.
But Christianity asks that you

416
00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:01,200
give out all to God.
You know, and you heard the

417
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:06,560
story in my life.
I have no intentions of going

418
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:09,040
into ministry, writing a book or
whatever.

419
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:11,720
You know, it's like I said, none
of this was my idea.

420
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:16,600
But there have been so many
places where we call them to do

421
00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:20,160
that.
And that's, that's I believe,

422
00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:24,960
the biggest obstacle that people
have to know that there's going

423
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:30,680
to come a time when in our
facing what Jesus Christ did on

424
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:36,080
the cross, that we have to let
all of that fall away and give

425
00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:38,760
it to God and let God do with it
what he will.

426
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:42,920
But as I said, there, there have
been so many things that I've

427
00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:46,480
seen in my life and it in my
life and in others where the

428
00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:51,360
blessings just pour out and we
are blessed to be a blessing.

429
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:54,480
And when we do that, and when
we're faithful to it, God

430
00:30:54,480 --> 00:31:00,280
returns it in many, many ways.
Yeah, wow.

431
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:07,400
Thanks for illuminating control
and I, I think you're spot on

432
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:10,480
with that.
I certainly have earlier parts

433
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:15,360
of my life where 100% it was
about me and me being in

434
00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:17,520
control.
And it's pride and ego that

435
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:20,840
drives that so often, certainly
for me and for most other folks.

436
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,520
So I track with you on so much
of that.

437
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:29,120
The Holy Spirit, I'll just add
here briefly gave me a, a, a, a

438
00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:33,240
wonderful bit of insight a
number of years ago where he

439
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:38,800
shared with me very clearly that
because I was created, I was no

440
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:45,320
longer central in my life, but
instead I was subject to in my

441
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:49,200
life.
And by God's grace, that became

442
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,360
clear for me, you know what I
mean.

443
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:56,000
And, and as a result of that, I
was able to begin to have

444
00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:58,520
completely different prayers and
completely different

445
00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:03,240
conversations with God where it,
it, it went from my list of will

446
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:08,520
you please do this stuff for me?
Will you answer these prayers?

447
00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:12,680
God sort of the genie in the
bottle type of God.

448
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:18,280
And instead my prayers turn to
OK, your will be done.

449
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:22,080
What is that will?
What do you want me to do?

450
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,800
Thy will be done as the hardest
prayer to honestly pray.

451
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:32,360
And I refer to the desire for a
genie in the in in the bottle to

452
00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:38,920
wanting God to be the divine
fixer and you know, fix God, fix

453
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:40,880
my problems.
And if you don't fix my problems

454
00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:42,120
then I'm not going to have
anything to do.

455
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:47,200
With you, yeah, yeah.
And I think you like you

456
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:51,320
suggested, I mean, so many
people have that desire, even

457
00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:54,360
sitting, you know, on the couch
in the counseling session,

458
00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:56,640
right?
They, they're, they're there for

459
00:32:56,640 --> 00:33:00,520
the pain to be taken away and
for the problem to be solved.

460
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,440
So really track with you on all
of that.

461
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:10,520
Well, you have walked us through
a lifetime ultimately, obviously

462
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:15,000
up until sort of today, which
includes where you ended up

463
00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:20,520
going to school and why all the
way through to various different

464
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:25,760
things of not not anticipating,
moving from teaching into

465
00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:29,360
ministry and into counseling.
And so I think, you know, as we

466
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:32,440
kind of round a lot of these
conversations out, we get to the

467
00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:37,520
questions of was all of that
coincidence in the series of

468
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:42,840
events or was it God?
So, Constance, coincidence or

469
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:48,280
God?
The book's subtitle to The

470
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:51,360
Trouble with Jesus is
Considerations Before You Walk

471
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:56,280
Away.
We think we can walk away, but I

472
00:33:56,280 --> 00:34:01,720
want to remind you of things
like the the rich ruler And when

473
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:07,920
Jesus said to him, sell all you
have and take the money and give

474
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:14,040
it to the poor, he, Jesus was
filled with such love and

475
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:18,199
compassion for this man.
And yet the man turned around

476
00:34:18,199 --> 00:34:21,679
and walked away and Jesus
watched him walk.

477
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:25,400
He didn't follow him.
He didn't try to negotiate.

478
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:28,840
He didn't say, hey man, you
know, let's he let him walk

479
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:32,560
away.
And yet that love stayed there.

480
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:38,000
That and that's what I think.
Never, we never, ever walk away

481
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:45,360
from that grace that comes to
us, even when we think we can

482
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,239
just shut the door on this and
not have anything to do with it.

483
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:53,480
And yet God will follow us and
follow us, you know, for as long

484
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:59,960
as our soul exists to call us to
Him and to answer that question.

485
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:04,040
You know, when Jesus said I am
the resurrection of life, Do you

486
00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:07,320
believe this?
To answer that question and be

487
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:11,400
affirmative.
Yeah, so I don't want to put

488
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,920
words in your mouth, but it
sounds like you see that all of

489
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:18,360
which is transpired has
ultimately been God with his

490
00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:19,160
hand on you.
Oh.

491
00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:23,320
And his yeah, the Holy Spirit
with his hand on my throat,

492
00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:32,160
yeah, God will do that too.
Sometimes less gentle than

493
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:34,840
others, but again.
Yeah, sort of.

494
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:37,400
Whatever it takes to get our
attention.

495
00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:40,240
Absolutely, Absolutely.
Wow.

496
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:45,120
Well, tell us in sort of closing
here, how has your life changed

497
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:49,720
through all of this?
I, I've, I've been blessed.

498
00:35:50,240 --> 00:35:54,080
My marriage is a blessing.
You know, my husband and I,

499
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:59,120
we're, we're A-Team within our
church and the ministries and,

500
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:04,640
you know, when we teach, we play
off one another and that, that's

501
00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:09,960
been a beauty.
Our son is also married to a

502
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:13,600
wonderful woman.
They're very faithful in their

503
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:19,840
participation in their church
and in the giving and being very

504
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,840
generous in that.
He has a strong belief and he's

505
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:24,920
willing to speak to it at any
time.

506
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:30,480
And yeah, as far as the
provisions of our life, as I

507
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:34,240
said, we have all we need and,
you know, measure of enjoyment

508
00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:37,840
in that.
But most important is that God

509
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:41,080
has given me purpose.
And you would think somewhere

510
00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:45,760
along the line that all this
should fall away and that, you

511
00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:49,880
know, I should just have life to
live, but I don't.

512
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:53,880
I have purpose.
I have a reason to get up.

513
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:56,720
I have a place in which to
serve.

514
00:36:57,040 --> 00:37:00,600
I have people who've come into
my life that I never would have

515
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:04,400
known otherwise.
And that's been the biggest

516
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:08,080
difference.
I, I understand that that

517
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:13,720
purpose, in whatever way,
whether it's noticeable like as

518
00:37:13,720 --> 00:37:16,520
it is through ministry, or
whether it's something that's

519
00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:20,840
private, just known to me and
maybe my family, that purpose

520
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:24,480
will always be upon me and that
purpose is to serve my Lord.

521
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:29,600
Wow, man, thanks for sharing.
That purpose being very

522
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:33,240
powerful.
Well, Constance, tell us about

523
00:37:33,240 --> 00:37:36,800
how we can get the book or learn
more about the book.

524
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:38,840
Where can we also stay in touch
with you?

525
00:37:39,720 --> 00:37:44,120
The the best way is through my
website constanthastings.com and

526
00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:48,560
let me tell you about that.
The website is actually a blog

527
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:54,480
that is a companion to the book.
It has in a 10 minute read that

528
00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:58,720
voice of the skeptic in there,
but deals with a very specific

529
00:37:58,720 --> 00:38:03,000
gospel passage of Jesus Christ.
So you can go through and and

530
00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:07,320
and read that alongside the book
book book of courses in a

531
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:11,920
broader scale.
And you can subscribe to that

532
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:13,800
blog.
And if you subscribe to the

533
00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:18,560
blog, there's a pop up there on
the website and you can receive

534
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:23,760
a link and a promo code where
you can get the book at 20% off,

535
00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:28,400
plus a free digital copy of the
book that the publisher provides

536
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:31,320
so that that's available as
well.

537
00:38:31,600 --> 00:38:35,240
And again, through my website,
you can contact me, you know,

538
00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:38,080
through through the e-mail on
the on our website.

539
00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:41,840
And I'd be glad to talk about
your troubles with Jesus.

540
00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:47,080
The book also is available.
Let me say this, anywhere that

541
00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:49,680
you love to buy books, you know,
if you don't want to do the

542
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:53,040
online retail thing, go to your
local bookstore.

543
00:38:53,240 --> 00:38:58,760
And I say that because online
retailers, you know, the book is

544
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,680
shipped from someplace.
It's put into an envelope, label

545
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:08,120
stamped on it in the mail, gone.
But in a bookstore, somebody has

546
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:12,680
to open that box, take the books
out, hold them in their hands,

547
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:16,240
shelve them.
People come by, they look at it,

548
00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:20,800
they, you know, read through it.
It has so much more exposure.

549
00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:26,240
And that can be available to
more people than even just the

550
00:39:26,240 --> 00:39:29,760
one who buys the book.
Yeah, awesome.

551
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:35,400
Well, thanks for outlining all
of that, Constance hastings.com.

552
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:38,960
And we'll make sure that we link
all of that in the description

553
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,160
for this episode.
It's been a real pleasure having

554
00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:44,960
you on.
Thank you so much for telling

555
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:47,320
your story.
And then also illuminating a lot

556
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:51,960
of the things that the skeptic
voice as well as the real

557
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:55,280
skeptic have wondered about and
how to also work through some of

558
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:57,240
that.
So really appreciate having you

559
00:39:57,240 --> 00:39:58,880
on when you look.
Thank you a bunch.

560
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:07,000
Thank you.
Was it coincidence or God?

561
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:12,280
You decide for yourself, but I
believe you just heard a story

562
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:16,240
for His glory.
When You Look is powered by

563
00:40:16,240 --> 00:40:19,760
stories just like this and yours
could be next.

564
00:40:20,160 --> 00:40:24,360
Go to whenyoulook.com/be a guest
or use the link in the

565
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:28,360
description below.
Drop us a comment and share this

566
00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:30,480
episode with somebody that needs
it.

567
00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:35,240
Until next time, thanks a bunch
for listening and watching, and

568
00:40:35,240 --> 00:40:36,040
God bless.